Hilary Dudek and I have been laid off multiple times. Here, we compare notes on how to handle those first few hours and days, before you even begin looking for your next role.
When the rug is pulled out from under you, where do you land? In this episode, Hilary unravels the emotional tapestry of unemployment, weaving through her personal narrative with honesty and vulnerability. This episode isn't just about the nuts and bolts of job hunting; it's a deep dive into the heart and soul of career transitions. Hilary opens up about the labyrinth of feelings that surface when you're laid off—the unexpected relief, the creeping panic, and the eventual steadying breath as you take stock of your resources. She underscores the importance of maintaining a perspective that is rooted in gratitude and self-assessment, rather than falling prey to the scarcity mindset that can so easily ensnare us during times of change.
As we turn the page, I reflect on the transformative power of such career-defining moments, sharing my own journey of self-discovery and realignment. This part of our conversation is an invitation to listeners to pause and ponder their career aspirations, to write them down, and to resist the knee-jerk reaction to scramble for the next opportunity. Instead, we explore how aligning with our true self can illuminate the path forward. Even after you land a job, the journey isn't over. We talk about the importance of ongoing self-evaluation to ensure that personal and professional growth continue to go hand in hand. If you're looking for a companion through your own career upheaval, let this episode be your guide to finding your footing with grace and intention.
I'd love your thoughts on this episode! Comment below, and like/love/share/support if you found this inspiring, thought-provoking, or useful!
Transcription
Charlotte Ward: 0:13
Hello and welcome to episode 254 of the Customer Support Leaders podcast. I’m Charlotte Ward. Welcome Hilary Dudeck to talk about being back on the job market. I’d like to welcome back to the podcast today Hilary Dudeck. Hilary, lovely to have you back again. Thank you for joining me. How are you doing?
Hilary Dudek: 0:40
I am doing so well. Thank you so much for having me back. It’s been a long time. It’s good to be back.
Charlotte Ward: 0:46
Indeed, indeed. Thanks so much. So you brought this topic to me and it’s one that I know a lot of people are. Well, it’s an experience a lot of people I know are going through right now or have recently. And, yeah, I think just the more people we can get to talk about this topic and be out there with their experiences, the better. So, what are we talking about today?
Hilary Dudek: 1:14
So today I thought it would be really interesting, and probably hopefully a morale boost, to talk about being laid off, being unemployed and sort of dealing with everything that comes with it, because it’s more than just a job search right, it’s more than just having to go through applications. So yeah, having recently gone through it myself and come out on the other side, it’s something that’s very, very recent for me still.
Charlotte Ward: 1:41
I mean, you hit the nail on the head. It’s so much more than a job search, and thank you for bringing that, because when we talk about even the experience of being laid off, we dive straight into the search side of it so quickly. I’ve done that on this podcast, I’ve done that when I’ve written before and that’s the theme of so many blogs and other shows out. There is kind of how do you find the next thing? But actually the experience of being let go, of being laid off for whatever reason, is a difficult one, isn’t it?
Hilary Dudek: 2:16
It really is. You go through a ton of emotions, of course, everything from maybe you feel relief because of the situation or the company or what is happening, stress, of course, panic. I certainly felt panic as well and sort of this. Okay, what do I do now? I was very privileged and I want to acknowledge that on this podcast. I had a decent amount in savings. We had a little bit of runway. I recognize that not everyone is going to resonate with some of the things I say, because not everyone has that blessing, but I had fortunately been able to save a little bit so it didn’t hurt quite as bad.
Charlotte Ward: 3:00
But it still hurts emotionally and spiritually, doesn’t it? Whatever the reason, whether there’s a 20% reduction in force or whether it’s a what, at the very least, feels like a targeted layoff, it all takes its toll, doesn’t it? It’s so easy to take it personally.
Hilary Dudek: 3:21
Absolutely To take it personally, to dwell in the past and think, well, if only I’d done this different or that different, or maybe if this initiative had succeeded. You start diving into what ifs, which is not a good place to be, but neither is operating from a scarcity mindset either, and just sort of looking to the future, and so that’s where I really found for myself personally. My struggle is remaining present. That’s not something that I do very easily. I’m either constantly looking ahead to the next thing or I’m dwelling on the past, and neither is productive, especially when laid off.
Charlotte Ward: 4:01
Yeah, yeah, there’s a certain amount of acceptance that you have to go through. I’m a little like you. I’m constantly moving forward, I’m always looking to the next thing. Never satisfied, never been grateful for what I have, never in the present, always in the next thing. That’s where my head always is, and the same is particularly true under the kind of layoff circumstances. And I love what you said about the scarcity mindset, which I want to pull on a string, I want to pull on in a minute. But that mindset of kind of constantly looking forward, it can Interrupt your ability to process what you’ve been through, but also it can make you panic, can’t? It’s like I need to figure this out really quickly. So tell me a little bit about the scarcity mindset in that moment. Is that what you’re recognizing really in terms of those kind of emotions, that presence that you talked about before? What’s the scarcity mindset to you in that moment?
Hilary Dudek: 5:00
Yes, it’s similar to not being balanced or remaining in the present. I think it’s also something that I was operating out of a scarcity mindset long before I had been laid off, so it’s not unique to being laid off, but I think it certainly rears its head, because now you’re actually experiencing scarcity. But, yeah, just never being satisfied, just always pushing, never giving yourself rest, always moving towards that next thing and never stopping to think well, will this next thing actually enhance my quality of life? Not just my job or my title or my career, but like, am I actually happy with what I have and where I’m at? And yeah, so that’s what I mean by the scarcity mindset Just constantly feeling like you need to do more, instead of sitting back and going. For me, at least I do have some savings. I have a house, I’m not homeless, I have a family, I have a support system, I have community. Okay, things are not that bad. Let’s see what I can tackle, what I can handle, what’s under my control, but then letting the rest be and that’s something that I’m not good at Is relinquishing control.
Charlotte Ward: 6:10
Yeah, I hear you. I hear you that taking stock is super important, because otherwise, I think it’s very easy to go into that place where you assume it’s all about you, and that brings on a sort of despair, doesn’t it? If not a depression, it’s certainly a despair that I think is difficult for anyone to cope with. And I think, taking that moment to say, okay, these are the assets, whether they’re financial or familial or like support, network or community, whatever it is, these are all skills, even right, this is actually what I have inside me, and doing an audit and an inventory of that landscape is really helpful to say, as you said, things aren’t as bad as I think they might have been otherwise in this moment and you made the fair point earlier. Not everyone has all of those blessings, but you have to know what you have at your disposal right. It’s worth doing that audit.
Hilary Dudek: 7:11
Yeah, it’s worth taking the inventory and seeing what you have and also, I think, spinning things not in a toxic way, but just in a naturally positive way. For example, yes, when I was laid off, I had a lot of time, but I had a lot of time to create. You and I have swapped our procreate drawings in another time. I had much more time to create. I had much more time to just be with myself, which is very scary but also really freeing and very healthy, I think, and I think it expedited my healing process. I had a lot of time to talk to people in the support driven community. Every so many people reached out to me and we just set up these lovely one on ones during the day. So I felt like I was still contributing, I was still active, talking to people. I wasn’t just hiding in my room, it was just truly lovely. And so, you know, just finding the time to do other things because, yes, you should be applying to jobs, obviously, but maybe not right away. That’s something that I did to me. We can touch on that. Don’t panic, apply to everything. That is like.
Charlotte Ward: 8:15
Yeah, yeah. I mean I have been laid off three times in a row and the first time I did exactly that panic apply, go into that cycle. I’m like, oh my God, if only I’d done this, if only I’d been that. I’ve got to get out there, I’ve got to get a job I didn’t take stock. But, believe me, the second and third times yeah, I’ve written this rodeo before. I know what it looks like. I don’t need to panic. This is, these are the things. These are the things I have. But also, to your point, these are the things I need to cultivate. You know, I need to cultivate a better network. I need to cultivate skills. I need to cultivate probably some self esteem as well, because getting laid off is as as, as, as healthily as you might handle it. It does knock your confidence a bit and that might be temporary Hopefully it’s temporary. But you know, like cultivating all of those things and rebuilding yourself ready for not not from the ground up like I’m not talking about a complete kind of breakdown of personality and rebuilding a new you here, but I just think like there’s an element of kind of I’m building for the next stage now.
Hilary Dudek: 9:25
Yeah, yes, yes, exactly. In taking stock of where you are in your assets, I think also includes taking stock of, okay, what did I like about this previous company? What did I not like, what did not fit? Well, knowing myself a little bit better and that I am not able to stay present very easily, maybe don’t apply to these job postings that say works well under pressure and can multitask, like a fee, I can do those things. I need to stop doing those things so much. I need to back off. So I think that is it, and then sticking to what you find and what you determine to be a good fit for you and not applying to the jobs that don’t you feel will not be a good fit.
Charlotte Ward: 10:09
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And the other thing that occurs to me is you know when, gosh? I mean it’s more years ago than I I would want to admit to. Let’s just say that but one of the very first roles I wasn’t let go from, but that I left. Somebody commented it was a very casual comment, but like so many things early in your career, they kind of really stick with you and bear in mind I wasn’t let go but nonetheless it still holds true. I think and that is what that person said to me was the second best thing you did so far in your career was to join this company, and I won’t tell you what the company was, but that was the second best thing I’d done. The best thing was to be leaving that company and I thought that was a really interesting take because joining the company was a really good thing. I learned so much. I grew professionally and you know, in terms of my technical skills and everything Like I grew in so many ways it was part of my growing up. That’s how many years ago it was, but nonetheless it wasn’t the end of good experiences for me at that point and actually leaving was the beginning of a new chapter and really what I took from that was I’ve got everything that I was ever destined to get from that role. And now, this moment, now is the best moment, because now I have more than I started with and now I’m building for the future, and I really liked that view of it.
Hilary Dudek: 11:53
I think that’s a really awesome view. That person was wise. They had some perspective that maybe you didn’t have, but that is very true and I think you know, once again, privileged place when you’re not straight up panicking. But that’s absolutely what this was. It was the start of a whole new chapter and it forced me to reevaluate what I wanted, and I wrote those things down. I think there’s some power in writing and I wrote down that I wanted a creative career. I was no longer interested in health care. I wanted these attributes in my next role and just folks. It forces you to focus, and I was so proud of myself a couple of times when I got my LinkedIn alerts for these jobs that did not fit that criteria and I was about to click apply, I said universe, you see this, I’m not going to do it. I’m not doing it. I really want to, though.
Charlotte Ward: 12:47
Good to you Good to you.
Hilary Dudek: 12:49
Very free. It took a while. It took about six weeks to get to that point.
Charlotte Ward: 12:53
Yeah, yeah, and I mean to be honest. As much as we say don’t panic apply, I think it’s perfectly natural to hit the LinkedIn easy apply a few times the day. You will let go sometimes, Right. Oh yeah it just that we all have that moment. I’ve done it every single time. I’ll go out and click easy, apply on the first five and just, and then I sit back and think I don’t know what I was thinking. But OK, let’s not do that anymore.
Hilary Dudek: 13:17
And then also you get the declines, like four weeks later and you’re like what the heck role was this? Did I apply?
Charlotte Ward: 13:23
Yeah, I don’t even remember. It’s like you’re in another place, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely so. If we were to take I mean, we talked a lot about handling and just taking stock in that first day a few weeks, right, and really is what we’re talking about. Just super briefly, and maybe I’d love you to come back and explore more about the search side of this another time. I think that would be awesome. How do you, I guess? The final question I want to ask you, though, given that you’re going to come back, please, I’m holding you to ransom now by saying you’re going to come back, live on air, but my last question really is this how do you know when you have taken sufficient stock and it’s time to actually move into a more active search? When does that stop?
Hilary Dudek: 14:19
I think for everyone it will look differently, but for me it was when I felt like myself, which is, I know, a very ambiguous feeling. But I know how Hillary feels when she’s in a good place and maybe life isn’t even good, but she’s in a good place and she’s doing things. She’s got an optimistic viewpoint and she’s very balanced. I’m very balanced across all areas of my life and I know what it feels now to be misaligned with that. So I had been misaligned for a year leading up to this layoff too. This was not unique to the layoff. I felt like myself again. I found myself being creative again. That is a signal for me. I found myself gravitating back towards colors. So, for example, actually doing fun makeup or dyeing my hair those things fall off. When I’m not myself I’m having painted my nails in over a year those things fall away. So, really paying attention to what feels like you and your inner child I know that sounds kind of like woo-woo, but what feels like you Then, when you feel like you’re in that good place, now move forward, can know your whole and you’re probably out of that reptile brain that’s screaming at you to pan and comply.
Charlotte Ward: 15:35
Yeah, yeah, that’s so true. That’s so true. I think you’re absolutely right. I think it’s a journey we all go on. That kind of journey of self-discovery and understanding who you are when life is calm and good is really important, so that you recognize it when it comes around again, that’s for sure. I couldn’t agree more yeah.
Hilary Dudek: 15:58
Yeah. So don’t stop taking stock, even once you land that job or you move past whatever crisis your face is facing. Keep taking stock, and that’s something that I’m going to work on. Moving forward is just maintaining that pulse with yourself.
Charlotte Ward: 16:12
Yeah, yeah, Perfect. That makes perfect sense to me. Thank you so much for joining me today. Hilary, Please come back and talk about the second half of this. Won’t you the actual search where it begins Once you’ve counted all of your blessings and you’re in that happy place and you’re calm and you’re ready for the next stage. Will you come back and do that?
Hilary Dudek: 16:32
I would love to Absolutely.
Charlotte Ward: 16:38 That’s it for today. Go to customersupportleaderscom. Forward. Slash 254 for the show notes and I’ll see you next time. Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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